给花街达人:什么是 capital destroyed

本帖于 2014-08-06 21:14:50 时间, 由普通用户 heure 编辑

你不愿给咱们上课,只好咱来上了。


假设一个学生向政府贷款$100k student loan. And it gets "securitized" and sold to some "smart" money manager, so Fed agency no longer hold it.

Queston: if the student default, let say 15% default rate (just throwing a number), does it matter to economy if Fed agency no longer holds the bag?

To 花街达人, it does NOT matter since it no longer in Fed agency's hand, and the money manager supposes to be "smart".


Let me try to debunk it.


case 1, if the money manager is smart, he will never buy the securitized bond at face value (100K) due to 15% default risk, for simplicity, let say, he is only willing to pay 85K and take some residual risk. In this case, the Fed agency (Sallie Mae, etc) will lose 15K to begin with. Who will pay the cost? of course, tax payer;

case 2, assuming the money manager is dummy enough to buy the bond at face value (100K). Later the student defaults by 15%, now the bond is only worth 85K. So who pays the cost? The fund the money manager manages, of course. But who owns those funds to the end? most likely, pension funds, 401Ks, etc. In another words, some tax payers.

so it does NOT matter which case (1 or 2), as long as the student defaults, somebody gets to pick the cost. The portion he defaults is called capital destroyed. And destroying capital hurts economy badly, thinking about bleeding ...

some may say, but by law the student cannot default. It does not matter. If he cannot pay (no income, etc), you are not going to get the loan (capital) back. Law cannot create/preserve capital, law may apply punishment if he defaults.





所有跟帖: 

这个好,清楚。不是靠帽子大。 -soundofsilence- 给 soundofsilence 发送悄悄话 soundofsilence 的博客首页 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:04:56

:) -career- 给 career 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:57:55

要不咱们就Bond一问一答?您先请 -heure- 给 heure 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:10:05

No longer think he is "unable to formulate any argument, keep di -career- 给 career 发送悄悄话 (506 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:28:20

since u r so confident, what is special and what is GC? -heure- 给 heure 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:14:05

i am not even a teller, I am just a grocery clerk -heure- 给 heure 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:24:21

with ECB at negative rate, will Fed follow suit going negative? -heure- 给 heure 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:23:20

好了好了, 你要考CFa还是啥? 这类东西多得好像牛毛, 谁能都记住啊 -May1995- 给 May1995 发送悄悄话 May1995 的博客首页 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:29:19

我一售货员就瞎蒙 :) -heure- 给 heure 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:32:48

He is treating you politely. You are losing your manner. -career- 给 career 发送悄悄话 (56 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:25:00

大致也就是这样。 理论上没啥大错。 但是你没考虑贷款收益在收益曲线上的位置, -May1995- 给 May1995 发送悄悄话 May1995 的博客首页 (115 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:10:26

俺不懂理论,就点common sense :) -heure- 给 heure 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:12:52

我感觉资本社会, credit是最基本的东西, 想避免是不可能滴。 主要是能够对风险做出较为精确的估计。 -May1995- 给 May1995 发送悄悄话 May1995 的博客首页 (86 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:18:25

credit是最基本的东西--not in "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal" :) -career- 给 career 发送悄悄话 (297 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:41:46

ABS再怎么复杂 多少twist, 基本上就是一个字:credit. 万变不离其宗。 -May1995- 给 May1995 发送悄悄话 May1995 的博客首页 (134 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:20:00

这个加上通胀因素,也就在线上挪一点,差不了太多。 -soundofsilence- 给 soundofsilence 发送悄悄话 soundofsilence 的博客首页 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:16:57

吓人啊,整半天您是花街的? -heure- 给 heure 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:36:38

你吓到我了,我这游手好闲的,哪能在花街混? -soundofsilence- 给 soundofsilence 发送悄悄话 soundofsilence 的博客首页 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:49:03

You don't know how to make simple things as complicated as possi -career- 给 career 发送悄悄话 (72 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:55:01

简单的事情复杂化都是为了忽悠,其实不能用一句话解释的事情,基本都是忽悠:) --百科-- 给 -百科- 发送悄悄话 -百科- 的博客首页 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:17:40

I hate to agree with you this time! :) -career- 给 career 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 22:26:18

Once MBS selling started, all MBS mark-to-market "values" got af -career- 给 career 发送悄悄话 (967 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 21:46:26

The capital destroyed is the student borrower's capital gain. It -近仁1995- 给 近仁1995 发送悄悄话 (0 bytes) () 08/06/2014 postreply 23:38:26

You clearly do not understand securitization structures. -vest2005- 给 vest2005 发送悄悄话 (582 bytes) () 08/07/2014 postreply 04:48:54

呵呵好,牛人来了。 -May1995- 给 May1995 发送悄悄话 May1995 的博客首页 (346 bytes) () 08/07/2014 postreply 06:57:53

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